"We All In” cuz we all OUT
Thursday, May 14, 2009 at 1:06AM May 13, 2009
Back last summer I was approached by Humility’s Hand (Denver) (then known as Bandit) about a collaborative project involving (potentially) eight emcees on the gay side of the Hip Hop game. The track already included some hot verses from Chewy, Humility’s Hand, and Last Offence, so I was eager to contribute to the track and offer and older school representation on the project. Because the UK, Denver, and LA were already represented, Humility’s Hand sought my expertise and insight to broaden the project. I also got my new comrade/lil brother J.A.P.A.N on the track to help me rep the South. Understanding that hardly everyone I love could be on the track, the other collabos were strategic for me. Tori Fixx had production experience and good flow and both Bry’Nt and Soce represent two of the more dynamic, if different, styles on the NY scene right now. I was really proud that there were gay rappers reppin' both old and newer schools in OHH, as well as the West Coast, East Coast, Midwest, and South.
For all of my seasonal pessimism about the lack of unity and all the catty backbiting and shade among OHH artists, this collaboration painted a different picture. We are all in and we’re all out. In because we find some sense of community by mobilizing via mediums like OHH to encourage, battle, collaborate, etc… We’re both OUT and OUT because by virtue of our sexual orientations, we are placed outside of an homophobic industry that privileges marketing and image over real talent. If most of us were straight or closeted, based on skill alone, I have no doubt that half of us would have deals with either major or Indie labels. If the industry really wanted to make GHH mainstream, they have the resources to paint a picture as captivating as Ellen or Elton John. Maybe it’s that gays are still afraid of “niggas” (or people who love “nigga music”). Maybe it’s that Hip Hop is terrified of talented fags. It’s likely a little of both.
There were other prospects for inclusion in “We All In”, but thanks to Out Hip Hop and GHH, there are tons of great collaborations happening. I knew this wouldn’t be the last of its kind, if the most vast to date. A question came up about whether or not we should add a woman on the track and that seemed shrewdly tokenistic at best. I thought back to a conversation I had on okayplayer.com with a few gay rap fans who lamented that the female side of the gay rap game was a great deal more solid/tight than what men have been presenting. As a founding member of Deep Dickollective, I was pretty upset at this presumption, though I understood that it was largely a marker of both their internalized homophobia and a comparative dissonance if all you listen to are backpacker straight boys. I think there’s little debate in Hip Hop that lesbians can spit—perhaps an ironic if dismissive double standard which offers lesbian and transmen a bit more leverage than us true “fags”.
Rappers like Invincible, Hanifah Walidah, Medusa, and many others don’t even actively affiliate with OHH artists because they’ve managed to sustain generous followings (of both queers and straights) without needing to label themselves Out Hip Hop artists. There’s also a burgeoning movement of transwomen who, due to their sexual semblance to the Trinas and Little Kims of the industry, don’t visually (or sonically) disrupt the status quo, if facing very real discrimination still on the basis of their gender non-conformity. For these reasons, I didn’t feel we needed to be apologetic about a track full of gay men rapping about exclusion by the mainstream; its focus is a strength of the collaboration.
Listening to the track, now that it’s finished, if almost a year later, I’m really impressed by the stylistic diversity of the participating artists; and their different positions on what unity means. Some of us outright attacked a homophobic industry for continuing to dismiss some of the more talented emcees OUT (no pun intended) while Soulja Boys of the industry leave much to be desired (e.g. Is that “kiss you through the phone” song serious?!). Others pointed to the hateration within our own ranks. The irony of “battles” between queer emcees when the notion of a battle between OUT emcees is dismissed and minimized by many hetero emcees as mere cat fighting. I’ve done it, and I regret it.
There are artists about the craft or art of rhyming, others just having fun, as well as those seriously trying to break through the homophobic bubble of the mainstream. As for me, I’m impressed whenever I look back at my body of work (from DDC to solo projects) and feel that my projects can stand solid against a number of garbage mainstream projects benefiting from the “dumbing down” of Hip Hop audiences by songs that amount to little more than an extended 2-4 word hook about the latest dance craze. Sidenote: I’m still waiting to do my Ashy Elbow song so I can blow up. (Anyone got ideas for the dance?! HOLLA). LOL
Yes, It may seem like I’m going on some kind of old school rant about Hip Hop aesthetics, and I applaud those rappers who strive principally to entertain, but I do think that some standard of valuation is worth examining here. I teach Hip Hop studies, and when I look at some of what OHH cats are doing lyrically, it’s a bit more consistent with Danny Hoch’s notion of rap aesthetics, including but not limited to: codification of language, call-and-response, sociopolitical context and legacy, metaphor and simile, illusion (magic), polyculturalism (immigrant and migrant), battle/braggadocio, lack of resources and access, African- and Caribbean performing traditions, criminalization of culture, among others. Who is more true to Hip Hop roots? Mainstream rap or Out Hip Hop. Things that make you go hmmmm…
Listening to “We All In”, all of these aesthetic standards are met—sometimes within one artists’ 16, if not across the thread of verbal assaults on a homophobic Hip Hop industry. When Danny Hoch talked about criminalization of culture, I doubt he had in mind the bashing and negativity towards gays within Hip Hop culture, but it applies. I’m sure that when he talked about “lack of safety” that he had no reference for the risks gay emcees take daily just to do their art against the often-unchecked tide of homo-hatred. I’m sure that when he talked about re-appropriation that he didn’t foresee gay rap cats re-contextualizing cultural metaphors in traditional anti-establishment fashion (“I be prime rib Adam and Steve,” “black rap Clay Aiken”, “If Elton John could do it, then fuck it, why not?” or “I’m the musical gay black Tony Soprano”).
I suppose all I’m saying is that DUDES…let’s have a little more confidence in what we’re doing. When you carry shame you’ll present shame. Do you have a point to prove to yourself or to others? If you are truly bringing your best, then stop being defensive about your craft. It’s what I most love about artists like Johnny Dangerous and Twizza, cute-ass cocky gayngstas! If Kanye can do it, why not you?! LOL. I hope that we come to a point listening to anthems like “We All In” where we can celebrate the work we’ve done to increase the stakes in the game and produce not just BETTER gay/out Hip Hop, but BETTER Hip Hop period. I’m really proud of the work that most OHH artists are doing to step their games up. Am I a fan of every style or all the songs? NAW. But I think any queer who can continue honing their craft for more than a few years without becoming completely demoralized or depressed is a hero in the making. Just recently two eleven-year old boys of color hung themselves because they’d been taunted for being gay in schools. This OHH shit is so much bigger that you, sons. Pat yourselves on the back, bruhs. The best is yet to come and we got so many lives to save. “We All In” as surely as we all OUT.
Download the broad collaborative work, "We All In", HERE
Reader Comments (19)
Bry'Nt and Tori Fixx and SOCE! killed it - I know it isnt a contest -- but they was on point- Overall a good track and great message!
It's finally done! I love how it turned out and I'm very happy to have been apart of something this "big" still being so new to the Out Hip-Hop community. Much respect to everyone on the track -- brave somma-ma-bitches!
A great track! Thanks.
Great track, great blog. Nice to see this. Reminds me of a moment in musical history when someone said, "Fight the REAL enemy". For the out hip hop world, the real enemy is the mainstream hip hop record industry that won't give any of you a chance. How many rhymes can you spit about the silly shit parading as hip hop they give major label deals to but won't sign a Last Offence, Melange Lavonne, or The Qure?
Hey folks,
in addition to posting here, if any of you post at okayplayer.com I've posted a link called:
Lions, Tigers, and Gay Rappers, Awwww Shit!
It's really important that we don't just preach to the choir. The post has almost 300 hits but very few comments. Hopefully this can serve a legitimate introduction to many of some great he/art.
holla.
This is a prime example of quality OHH/GHH work. Yes it did take some time to get this project finished but I believe it was worth the wait for so many reasons. I'm old school so this shit reminds me of "Self Destruction", which was some powerful shit back in the day (still is) and I think "We ALL In" is of the same caliber. If this don't kick down some more doors and smack plenty of "breeders" upside the head and make them take note, I don't know what will. Thank yal for letting me be down (and for making a brotha step his game up).
you the best, T. fixx. Thanks for your patience with the collaboration and you're right. people are already skurred o of this joint.
LOL. Damn I can't believe it! Mex Stone, WTF! I got this yo! Great song and I like the concept, beat was okay , one artist did stand out way above the rest but I know some people are easily excited by mediocrity!
Very very big thanks to everyone who worked on the track. I was sitting on the track since about 2000... I'm very excited it's finally finished and very proud of how the track turned out.
I’m already hearing from so many people so many different opinions on who was the best on the track. I think it’s funny and I smile because every one has a different opinion and I love it. I also think it’s a testament that you don’t have to battle rap another M.C. to test your skill and let everyone know you’re the best… Hope on a collaboration track and work together and see who shines.
I have not talked to the guys to see what’s going to be done with the Tori Fixx Mix of the track… but I’m sure everyone will be hearing it soon.
I'm very fortunate to work with so many talented people. I thank everyone that helps promote this art form from the bottom of my heart. I rap to get ish of my chest, to help understand the world around me and to control my own demons. So to get so many talented people to help me along the way is just unbelievable.
I do hope this is a step in a new direction of working together. Embracing our individualities and styles rather than knocking the other guy cause he dose not sound the same, act the same, rap the same, or have the same goals in this art form as the next man. Is that not the very thing we are looking to break from being gay rappers?
With that being said I’m not a gay rapper. I am a rapper who happens to be gay. I rap as the individual human being I am. I believe when you label or classify something or someone you place it in a box in your mind. You have preconceived notions at that point that makes it hard for you to think otherwise of the subject matter… gay… black… Iraqi… woman… Muslim… ect ect ect. We classify or group people so that are simple minds can understand the world. The simple truth is that we are individual human beings and there is no box you can put me, or any other being in, that will make you understand me, or any other being, any better.
Every track has it’s up’s and down’s… this one was def no different. It started back in 2000 and is just now finally completed. I can’t tell you how many times I thought the track was dead and how many e-mails it took to pull this off… again thanks for every ones patients and commitment to helping me get this track done.
This happens with a lot of tracks I work on… I start them and they sit on the shelf for years… then all the sudden it’s done. I think things happen for a reason and the time for this track is now. There has been a lot of “he said she said” cutting our own throats. New verses old school… US verses UK… Let’s just stop and start working together instead of coming off a petty drama queen bitches fighting over table scraps. I been in the middle of it too long and I’m just done with it.
In ways I feel like many are in a fight to make it to the top of the GHH game when what I’d really like to see it more artist going at the music industry as a whole. It’s not my place but I’m defiantly willing to help anyone who wants that place. I know it’s time for a break. Time for people to really stand up and take notice of what everyone here is doing.
For me… sitting all alone in my little apt with a mic and a computer… reaching out to people I respect a great deal with a simple idea… To see that idea spark emotions that I know come threw on the track… to stand with my peeps and say “naw naw… WE ain’t having it”… That is such a great feeling. I’m not all that. Sitting here all alone in my little apt with a mic and a computer… working a day job in construction 10 hour days 6 days a week… in Denver Colorado trying to help my peeps here in Denver get better off the little bit I’ve been able to teach myself… I know if I can start a little bit of talk… you guys with help… production… studios… time… a little money… talented people that surround you and back you… All I can say is think outside the box… connect the dots… and make it happen. I promise you that you have a whole nation of people that want you to make it past the 5 haters that say you never will.
Stay safe and have fun… Much love… Humility’s Hand
Awesome track!!! I'm thrilled with the way it turned out, and I think everyone killed it. Let's keep making this happen! Thanks for putting me on!
Don't forget to check out Humility's new track Like Diss (When We All In), which you can find on his myspace page, and I have a monster collabo track coming out real soon myself.. (features Humility's Hand and also.. ?)
Embrace the positivity, folks!!! Let's stay strong!!
Mex Stone, Rex Stone. Gotta love it. LOL. Next post will be Sex Stone... or Sharon Stone. LOL
much respect, Humility's Hand. Thanks for not giving up on the track. I appreciate the intent around not wanting to be considered a gay rapper... but I honestly don't understand how it's all that different to be a rapper who happens to be gay. It seems a devaluation or dismissal of some very real discrimination in the face of outright dehumanization. When I stop being pulled over in East Texas or Northern California for being a nigga; when i can have a union with a significant other and have all rights afforded to my sibs, then maybe I'll start being a human who happens to be black and gay. But I guess it takes all perspectives... I just tried the human thing and got reminded quickly that it's mere idealism. It's a disjunction between the way things should be and the way shit is.
sorry for the soapbox. It's all love.
JUST WHEN PEEPS THOUGHT WE WOULD SELF- DESTRUCT WE FLIP IT ON THEY ASSSES! U SMART BASTARDS!!
THIS SONG IS TIMELESS AND IS SURE TO GO DOWN IN HISTORY AS ONE OF THE FIRST OF ITS KIND!! YEAH, WE DID IT FIRST BITCHES...LOL
CHEWY: THE U.K. NEEDS TO BE "QURED" BABY, LETS MAKE IT HAPPEN!
BANDIT: I WISH I WAS CLOSER TO YOU...FORREAL.
LAST: I DONT THINK THEY READY FOR THE QURE & LAST OFFENSE ON A TRACK TOGETHER, WHAT U THINK?!
BRY'NT: PRETTY THUGS MY ASS! THEM NIGGAS BETTA BE GLAD WE GOT OTHER SHIT TO DO! LOLOL IN FACT, WE'LL BE IN TOUCH...
TORI: REAL RECOGNIZE REAL HOMIE.
SOCE: U KINDA REMIND ME OF ME AND THAT FUCKS ME UP A LITTLE! LOL
TIM: THANK YOU FOR EVERYTING. I'VE LEARNED ALOT FROM YOU IN A VERY SHORT PERIOD OF TIME, AND THIS IS ONLY THE BEGINNING. I LOVE YOU.
QUESTION: WHEN/WHERE'S THE VIDEO SHOOT?! LET'S DO THIS!!
Yo J.A.P.A.N. - I think the song is great - and it is great to see artists come together on a track like this - but FIRST ? There have been a lot of collabs including MY G.A.Y.N.G - which was on my second CD and included homohop all-starz - JEN-RO, KATASTROPHE, JB R.A.P, JOHNNY DANGEROUS, PROTEGEE, LUCKY 7, DUTCHBOY, TORI FIXX, JUBA KALAMKA, MARCUS RENE VAN, URBAN HERMITT, DRASTIKO, and myself - You are new to the scene so you didn't know -
I respect your view even though its different from mine. We can agree to disagree on how we see things, I just want to clarify what I was saying in my comment. I don’t mean disrespect or to devalue being gay…I just wanted to say that I rap about my life and what’s around me and that what IS around me isn’t always gay. I like to be thought of as a rapper who just raps about life and not about what’s just gay in my life. I am proud to be a gay rapper and feel immense honor to be with every gay rapper out there who is trying to send a piece of their life out into this world. I love and respect everyone for what they are doing and accomplishing. When I said I want to be thought of as a rapper who happens to be gay rather than a gay rapper, what I should have said is I want people to see the art before they see the painter, I want them to recognize the skill indiscriminately and then realize who it came from and break down some of their preconceived notions of what a gay rapper would be like. I don’t want labels to get in the way of my art. I want people to hear my music and connect to my life stories whether they are gay, straight or bisexual. I want them to hear about my joys, my dreams, my sorrows and my pains and vibe with me. While being gay is a part of my life, I think the emotions I have could come from anyone straight or gay and as an artist I want people to place the importance of how they perceive and label me on their own accord. If they want to see me as a rapper first who happens to be gay or as a gay man who is a rapper second doesn’t matter to me, just so long as they see the hard work and respect what I do. That is all I meant, I just want the art to be seen first as it is. Did not mean to devalue the fact that we are all trying to break down some barriers in the hip hop industry and gain the respect of people who think we should not be a part of it, you know I have love for everyone and am proud to be a part of this.
This is one of the best representations of Out hip-hop thus far! Absolutely reminincent of "Self-Destruction." And EVERYBODY did their thang on this track! Kudos to all involved and a special shout-out to Humility's Hand for his artistry!
I'm taking this track to Kayslay fo' sho'! The world needs to hear this!
I like this song. That guy wit the last verse kilt it tho. Good work!
Awww....
you and apollo are fing sick.... You know I got you guys...I'd love to be next to you guys and stress each otherst styles. You guys are one of the few that don't conform.... I love you guys
Evreyone says I sound **** I'll switch it up just to prove them wrong LOL
Our "We Are the World." You all make me feel so proud, and the song brought tears to my eyes
Love you all
Larry Kovacs
New York City